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Memory disorder / learning disabilties
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momo3boys
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Joined: 14 Feb 2006
Posts: 574
Location: Western Mass

PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2006 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is there any reason why a child HAS to learn how to diagram a sentence? Does anyone need to know besides english teachers. To me, good grammar is achieved by reading and writing and listening, as well as the little green line in WORD Laughing I figure if my children can fill out a madlibs book, they know more grammar than the average adult.

I need to know how to teach them to read, and write words.

But than you for the information, I didn't mean to get on my soap box. sorry Embarassed
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Theodore
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Joined: 06 Oct 2005
Posts: 2122
Location: Missouri, US

PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2006 9:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I promptly forgot how to diagram anything but a simple sentence as soon as I finished having to do it. It certainly didn't give me a better understanding of the English language. Only a lot of reading and writing (hopefully with critique) will improve your reading and writing.
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pamtidteach
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Joined: 04 Jul 2006
Posts: 6
Location: Texas

PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2006 9:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Any student entering college is expected to know how to identify the basic parts of speech and the basic parts of a sentence. This includes dependent and independent clauses, phrases, direct and indirect objects, transitive and intransitive verbs..etc, etc, etc... I have students that come to my school every year, in middle and high school, who cannot identify the subject and predicate, a predicate noun, an appositive, I could go on and on. These are not LD kids, these are Advanced Placement students....and they come from all over the country since we are at a military base.

After teaching for many years, and having a private school for the last nine, traditional grammar programs do not produce students who can identify these parts of speech and parts of a sentence consistently.

What I have found with Shurley is that it gives the students a tool to be able to identify the parts of a sentence...accurately and with a high rate of success. When my students take the SAT, and they are asked to determine what part of a sentence is incorrect, they can classify the parts of the sentence easly (oral diagramming) and find quickly what is in error. This is a skill college bound students need to have...whether they ever use it after college or not we can debate, but taking college entrance exams and getting through college level english classes, the skills are necessary.

This is the same thing I tell my students about Algebra.... I do not use it in every day life...but you have to take it, you have to understand it, and you have to pass it....to get into college and to get through college...
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Theodore
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Joined: 06 Oct 2005
Posts: 2122
Location: Missouri, US

PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2006 1:12 pm    Post subject: Grammar - by way of writing and foreign language: Reply with quote

I don't know. I only remember the more basic parts of speech from my grammar, yet I still managed to get 770 out of 800 on the verbal part of the SAT. Formal grammar / diagramming gives you far too much theory and not enough practice, while regular reading and writing builds the patterns without bashing you in the head with them. What's more, writing teaches you how to write (obvious!), and it doesn't matter how good your grammar skills are if you can't organize a coherent essay.

If you really want to be able to name all the parts of speech, then you should study a second language. This will score you a nice chunk of high school / college credit, and it does a far better job of teaching you grammar than a course on English grammar.
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