Why I am against Homeschooling

Want to contribute your views on the homeschool vs public school debate, or just looking for information? Post here!

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hbmom36
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Postby hbmom36 » Mon Aug 07, 2006 8:39 am

I wanted to add something about this wonderful concept of "socialization." Three nights ago, I allowed my son (age 3) to play outside with the neighbor boys (ages 3 and 5). I wasn't wild about these kids, but Bruce wanted to play outside on his tricycle so I allowed it. Ten minutes later, I had a feeling I should check on him. The older boy had put his own tricycle in front of Bruce's, so he couldn't move. The younger boy was yanking my son's pants down and trying to shove a stick in his shorts. When I sent the little monsters home, the younger kid hit Bruce on the back and said, "You can't come to my house again!" Lovely!!
Now my kid is just as rough and tough as any boy. He's strong as an ox. He makes friends very easily, and as I said before he is comfortable with adults as well as kids of any age. He's also very gentle and sweet, and the concept of assaulting a playmate is absolutely foreign to him. The little creeps who did this to him are "socialized." The older one goes to preschool full-time during the school year. He's a vicious little boy. That's "socialization" for you!!

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Postby momo3boys » Mon Aug 07, 2006 9:50 am

Wha the children did to your son is horrible and it goes to wondering what the parents of this child are doing for or to him for him to behave like that. Especially for them to pull his pants down. We live in a scary world, and unfortunatley we have to defend our children from other children like this.
Phi 4:13 I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.

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Postby AnnetteR » Mon Aug 07, 2006 11:11 am

Like I said, schools don't teach socialization; that's a job for parents but many seem to think it's taught in school. It's not surprising though, after all, we are told that are children need to attend preschool in order to learn to socialize so it's no great leap to believe that socialization is going to be taught.

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Postby hbmom36 » Mon Aug 07, 2006 8:35 pm

momo3boys wrote:Wha the children did to your son is horrible and it goes to wondering what the parents of this child are doing for or to him for him to behave like that. Especially for them to pull his pants down. We live in a scary world, and unfortunatley we have to defend our children from other children like this.


Horrifying, isn't it? I had thought that the family was ok at first. My kids played with the little monsters a few times, but I had to put a stop to it because the older one would walk into our house without knocking, or if my daughter opened the door, would shove his way in. He walked into our bedroom at 8 o'clock one night and refused to leave. The evening that this happened, the little creeps just happened to be around and my son really wanted to go out and ride his tricycle. I'm just glad I went to check on him when I did. When I pulled the younger boy away, he told me "I play with my brother like this all the time."!!!! :shock:
I've met plenty of homeschooled kids that I didn't like, for whatever reason, but I couldn't imagine any of them assaulting another child like that.

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Postby nwfn » Tue Aug 15, 2006 2:48 pm

I would like to thank you, Against Homeschooling, for opening my eyes. I have been considering homeschooling for quite some time now, but through your posts here and in the Evolution vs. Creationism thread (boy, was that frightening! Thank God I'm an athiest!), I have come to see the light. Homeschooling is not the answer.

Instead I will do everything I can to improve conditions at the local public school or at the private school I've been considering. I will try to contribute to the improvement of society instead of throwing up my hands and sheltering my child from it. Thank you very much for your input :D

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Postby Against Homeschooling » Tue Aug 15, 2006 3:44 pm

I wanted to add something about this wonderful concept of "socialization." Three nights ago, I allowed my son (age 3) to play outside with the neighbor boys (ages 3 and 5). I wasn't wild about these kids, but Bruce wanted to play outside on his tricycle so I allowed it. Ten minutes later, I had a feeling I should check on him. The older boy had put his own tricycle in front of Bruce's, so he couldn't move. The younger boy was yanking my son's pants down and trying to shove a stick in his shorts. When I sent the little monsters home, the younger kid hit Bruce on the back and said, "You can't come to my house again!" Lovely!!
Now my kid is just as rough and tough as any boy. He's strong as an ox. He makes friends very easily, and as I said before he is comfortable with adults as well as kids of any age. He's also very gentle and sweet, and the concept of assaulting a playmate is absolutely foreign to him. The little creeps who did this to him are "socialized." The older one goes to preschool full-time during the school year. He's a vicious little boy. That's "socialization" for you!!


So you're going to keep your son locked inside all the time? I empathize with your negative experience - that really sounds like a terrible thing for you both to go through - but how can you possibly (especially as somebody who is ostensibly going to be educating your own children in the arts of logic and writing) use such an anecdote to condemn the entire concept of friendship? :roll:

nwfn: Your post really made my day. :D

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Odd concept of logic, maestro...

Postby Theodore » Tue Aug 15, 2006 7:13 pm

Anecdotal evidence isn't much use, but on the other hand, this isn't exactly an isolated incident - and one could debate that your posts are just as much anecdotal, and far less representative. Do you honestly think more homeschoolers hate being homeschooled than public schoolers hate being public schooled? If you do, then that's your opinion, but maybe you're in the wrong forum.

Also, while you're making good use of rhetoric, you're ignoring logic when you equate rejecting a situation with a high incidence of bullying to rejecting "the entire concept of friendship". Do you think bullying is the same thing as friendship?

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Postby hbmom36 » Wed Aug 16, 2006 10:08 am

Against Homeschooling wrote:
I wanted to add something about this wonderful concept of "socialization." Three nights ago, I allowed my son (age 3) to play outside with the neighbor boys (ages 3 and 5). I wasn't wild about these kids, but Bruce wanted to play outside on his tricycle so I allowed it. Ten minutes later, I had a feeling I should check on him. The older boy had put his own tricycle in front of Bruce's, so he couldn't move. The younger boy was yanking my son's pants down and trying to shove a stick in his shorts. When I sent the little monsters home, the younger kid hit Bruce on the back and said, "You can't come to my house again!" Lovely!!
Now my kid is just as rough and tough as any boy. He's strong as an ox. He makes friends very easily, and as I said before he is comfortable with adults as well as kids of any age. He's also very gentle and sweet, and the concept of assaulting a playmate is absolutely foreign to him. The little creeps who did this to him are "socialized." The older one goes to preschool full-time during the school year. He's a vicious little boy. That's "socialization" for you!!


So you're going to keep your son locked inside all the time? I empathize with your negative experience - that really sounds like a terrible thing for you both to go through - but how can you possibly (especially as somebody who is ostensibly going to be educating your own children in the arts of logic and writing) use such an anecdote to condemn the entire concept of friendship? :roll:

nwfn: Your post really made my day. :D


I don't think allowing him to be assaulted is the best way to raise him to be a functioning human being, is it? Maybe I should just help his "socialization" along and do it myself, hmmmm? This is NOT a kid who sits inside, at all. Neither of my kids do. We are out constantly, at the beach, playgroups, swimming, dance classes.

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Postby hbmom36 » Wed Aug 16, 2006 10:09 am

Does THAT behavior fit your definition of friendship???

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Postby hbmom36 » Wed Aug 16, 2006 10:54 am

nwfn wrote:I would like to thank you, Against Homeschooling, for opening my eyes. I have been considering homeschooling for quite some time now, but through your posts here and in the Evolution vs. Creationism thread (boy, was that frightening! Thank God I'm an athiest!), I have come to see the light. Homeschooling is not the answer.

Instead I will do everything I can to improve conditions at the local public school or at the private school I've been considering. I will try to contribute to the improvement of society instead of throwing up my hands and sheltering my child from it. Thank you very much for your input :D


If you're not up to the challenge of homeschooling, better not to take the risk. It takes a special, dedicated parent to homeschool. Obviously, you don't have it in you.

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Postby AnnetteR » Wed Aug 16, 2006 2:26 pm

nwfn wrote:I would like to thank you, Against Homeschooling, for opening my eyes. I have been considering homeschooling for quite some time now, but through your posts here and in the Evolution vs. Creationism thread (boy, was that frightening! Thank God I'm an athiest!), I have come to see the light. Homeschooling is not the answer.

Instead I will do everything I can to improve conditions at the local public school or at the private school I've been considering. I will try to contribute to the improvement of society instead of throwing up my hands and sheltering my child from it. Thank you very much for your input :D



What has the thread on Evolution vs. Creationism got to do with your decision not to homeschool? The opinions and beliefs of people on this forum have little to do with homeschooling, other than personal choices those people have made based on their religious predilection.

Choosing to homeschool doesn't mean that a person has thrown up their hands in favor of sheltering their child at home. That may very well be true for some homeschoolers but it's not the rule. Parents make the choice individually. If you don't find value in a Christian education then don't do it. If you are concerned about you or your child (I'm uncertain as to whether you are the child or the parent) being too sheltered then make better choices that include more socialization.

I personally don't think you can make many significant improvements in the school system. Many of the problems that parents complain about are problems that exist because of our culture.

For the record, I'm an agnostic and I'm not trying to shelter my child from society. My child is doing kindergarten and some first grade level work. If he were to attend public school he would have to repeat all the work he's already mastered at home. Why? Because children are segregated into grades by age; my child won't be of kindergarten age until next fall. I haven't been forcing or pressuring my child to learn either. He does so of his own accord. Like mother, like son; he loves to learn.

Don't throw all homeschoolers, even those who are members of this forum, under one blanket. We all have our own reasons and our own plans for homeschooling.

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Re: My oldest bro was accepted at the Coast Guard academy...

Postby blackhorse » Wed Aug 16, 2006 7:22 pm

Theodore wrote:My oldest bro homeschooled all the way up through high school, was accepted at the Coast Guard academy (which has one of the strictest sets of entrance requirements in the nation), graduated with honors, and is now happily married and based in California. He was quite popular at the academy, and has no trouble communicating with others.


As his wife, actually... he does have some social issues. But no sense in getting into them. Being in a position as political as the USCG, having superb social skills is necessary. He's not struggling more than anyone else, but it doesn't help being somewhat socially behind. He had to learn to make friends the hard way. Being in the USCG changed him and for the better only because secular college is so much worse than public school(at least the ones I know of)!

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Postby momo3boys » Fri Aug 18, 2006 6:05 pm

Against Homeschooling wrote: So you're going to keep your son locked inside all the time? I empathize with your negative experience - that really sounds like a terrible thing for you both to go through - but how can you possibly (especially as somebody who is ostensibly going to be educating your own children in the arts of logic and writing) use such an anecdote to condemn the entire concept of friendship? :roll:


Friendship is caring and love and what this little boy did is not friendship. If that was happening at a public school there is a good chance that nothing would have happened to help the victim, or the bully. When something happens at my coop's Gym time, I am able to talk to the children about it, and we come up with a different solution, together, they are being taught how to respect with people with all different views and cultures yet be safe with who they are, something that the public school cannot do, because they strive to make everyone the same, educationally, spiritually, and socially. I am sorry but I did not give birth to my children to watch them become robots!
Phi 4:13 I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.

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Postby GOBIGRED » Fri Aug 18, 2006 6:15 pm

I am a former elementary and special education teacher and I have 2 children now. I was in public school as a child (k-12) and taught for many years in public schools.

I think that it is fabulous that there are now options for homeschooling, charter schools, and magnet schools. I can't wait for tax credits and vouchers someday.

No matter what, PARENTS are in charge of their child's education; too many people just blame the system, teachers, or just walk away and their child doesn't blossom like they were intended.

When you have children, you have a whole other perspective. You notice gangs, drugs, bullies and other dangers out there. If anyone thinks that kind of thing just doesn't happen very often, they are kidding themselves or aren't truly aware of what is going on. Administrators and law enforcement are regularly trained to encounter happenings such as Columbine or terrorist type activities (such as what happened two years ago in Russia-331 students/parents died very tragic deaths).

If a child needs 24/7 tutoring until he or she masters math, writing, or reading skills, smart parents do whatever needs to be done to get them there. Not everyone gets special education if they are behind. Not everyone can home educate, either.

I remember my older brother getting his head pounded into the bus window, physically beaten by a gang of boys 5 years older than him, and locked in a trunk of a car during lunch hour and driven around town. The principal lookekd the other way until a friend encouraged me to tell my parents (believe me, we were scared of these thugs). My friend's parents and my parents got rid of the principal, but look at the cost...I have respect for my brother, but know that it certainly will scar him for life. And myself, I know I am a lot shyer person because of it, although getting out of that school was a positive turning point. My brother's fault? He was bucked tooth, 4 eyes, and a quiet geek. He is a very nice looking dad of three now.

So I respect differing opinions on this subject, but to downplay bullying is just not seeing the whole picture.

I am sure it could be lonely being homeschooled, although I know outgoing kids in the homeschool co-op in our church too. I personally am a one year at a time person, presently looking over homeschool material and asking my homeschool friends how they structure their day, but sending my oldest to Christian school---although I can see cliques already beginning to develop in 1st grade.

There is no perfect system. I am glad I have lots of choice.

Whatever Against Homeschooling decides, I hope you have an open mind. My mom (I am from a very long line of public educators) heard I was considering something besides public schools, she screamed at me and asked me if I was a true Christian (you know, the light in the dark philosophy). That was truly discouraging. But then, homeschooling people around her were being hard on people who educated their kids in public schools. I am thankful for my friends at my own church. We let each other make decisions and respect each other. We might not always agree, but life truly is more about schooling methods.

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Postby hyperhomeschoolmom » Tue Aug 29, 2006 9:40 pm

GOBIGRED wrote:


Whatever Against Homeschooling decides, I hope you have an open mind. My mom (I am from a very long line of public educators) heard I was considering something besides public schools, she screamed at me and asked me if I was a true Christian (you know, the light in the dark philosophy). That was truly discouraging. But then, homeschooling people around her were being hard on people who educated their kids in public schools. I am thankful for my friends at my own church. We let each other make decisions and respect each other. We might not always agree, but life truly is more about schooling methods.


I hate when people use the "light in the darkness" as a reason for Christian kids to be in public school. I do believe, as a Christian, that we should have Christian ADULTS in the schools. Jesus called full grown adults to go out to all the corners of the earth, not children. It's too much for a child, and throwing a Christian child into that situation is more likely to turn them away from God than to bring others to God. I am not saying that it never happens, just that chances are more Christians in school turn against God. I read somewhere where a mom said "the best armies in the world do not train their soldiers in the battlefield. There's too much room for casualties." I believe this applies here. Educate them at home, allow them to grow strong in their faith, prepare them diligently for what lies ahead, and they will be better prepared for the 'real world'. (Besides, schools certainly aren't the 'real world'.... it's silly to spend 7 or 8 hours a day locked in a room with 20 others born within 11 months of yourself. I've only seen that situation in schools... never since.)

Many adults that use that reasoning would look at you as though you lost your mind if you suggested to them that they should spend 8 hours a day, five days a week surrounded by non-believers. I don't know about you, but the majority of people in my church are friends with other church members. That doesn't mean that they never socialize with non-Christians, but the majority of the time, when they choose to have a get-together, it's with other believers. Why put a child in a position where most of their socializing happens with non-Christians?

Most 'socializing' in schools isn't the type of socializing tht I want for my kids anyway. The cussing, bullying, spitballs, and general disrespect of adults and authority are things I prefer my boys not to learn. My children have dealt with their share of bullying, and have learned how to handle it, but it's not been an everyday thing... at most once every couple of months. Why should a child have to deal with cr*p like that? It makes a child feel helpless as they have to face the bully everyday... the bully has a right to a free education and will remain in the class. Telling the teacher rarely stops the bullying... it may even make it worse. If I had someone in the adult world bullying me, I could file a police report and get a restraining order, but it doesn't work that way in school.

I believe that ANY loving, caring, committed parent can homeschool successfully. If something comes up that you don't know the answer to, be willing to learn along-side your child or look for a tutor. Just be willing to always look for an answer and you'll do fine.


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